What Most Founders Get WRONG with Florin Tatulea

Hiring the right SDRs requires looking for candidates with a 'chip on their shoulder' and inherent curiosity. Florin Tatulea emphasizes that founders must close the first 50 deals themselves to establish product-market fit before bringing in sales talent, generally waiting until they hit the $1M ARR mark. Prematurely hiring SDRs to find product-market fit is a critical mistake that leads to forced momentum, bad-fit customers, and ultimately, massive churn. Outbound strategy has fundamentally shifted. Rather than relying on the 'Outbound 1.0' approach of blasting tens of thousands of automated emails to a broad Total Addressable Market (TAM), modern sales teams must define their Serviceable Addressable Market (SAM). High-performing teams leverage tools to follow digital breadcrumbs and intent signals, fishing in a highly targeted pond rather than boiling the ocean to find buyers actively in-market. Looking forward, the evolution of outbound sales shouldn't be fully autonomous AI SDRs blasting more noise, but rather an 'Iron Man and Jarvis' dynamic. AI acts as an intelligent co-pilot, surfacing the right accounts and entry paths based on real-time signals, while leaving the nuanced relationship-building and complex deal navigation to human connection.

Discussed in this episode

• Why curiosity and asking great interview questions are the biggest predictors of long-term SDR success.
• The danger of hiring SDRs to find product-market fit instead of founders closing the first 50 deals themselves.
• Why reaching $1M ARR is a generally safe benchmark before actively scaling the outbound sales function.
• The critical difference between targeting your massive Total Addressable Market (TAM) versus your Serviceable Addressable Market (SAM).
• How modern prospecting relies on intent data and digital breadcrumbs to prioritize in-market buyers.
• The strategic advantage of intentionally turning away unqualified inbound demos to prevent long-term churn.
• The complex learning curve and timeline required to successfully promote an SDR to a full-cycle AE role.
• Using AI as a sales co-pilot to recommend outreach strategies rather than replacing reps with autonomous AI SDRs.

Episode highlights

1. 0:00 — Introduction and guest background
2. 1:25 — What makes a great SDR
3. 3:15 — The biggest red flag in interviews
4. 4:30 — Founder-led sales and product-market fit
5. 6:45 — Outbound 2.0 and intent signals
6. 8:20 — TAM vs. SAM in modern list building
7. 11:15 — Saying no to unqualified inbound deals
8. 14:05 — The path from SDR to Account Executive
9. 18:20 — Predictions on AI in outbound sales

Key takeaways

• Founders must close the first 50 deals to establish true product-market fit.
• Never hire SDRs to figure out your go-to-market strategy for you.
• Target your Serviceable Addressable Market (SAM) instead of boiling the total ocean.
• Use intent signals and digital breadcrumbs to identify buyers already in-market.
• Treat AI as a co-pilot to empower reps, not a human replacement.

Transcript

Let's face it, y'all. Hiring sales talent is a real pain in the ass. Getting A-players is key to bridging your go-to market gap, but it's harder than ever. If you're not actively engaging passive talent, you don't stand a damn chance.

That's why at Revenue Reimagined, we trust our partners at pursuit to help our clients find the best talent fast. If you're looking to strengthen your sales team, go check them out at pursuit sales solutions.com. Welcome back to another episode of the Bridge the Gap Podcast.

Today, we have Florence Atulia with us, who is the head of sales development at Common Room. He's been building pipeline for a decade in the B2B SAS world as an SDR, an AE, and a sales manager. Little side project, he's also building sales flow, which is a consultancy that provides workshops, thought leadership, and courses, mostly related to something y'all need to improve upon, which is the art of prospecting. We're going to dig into that a little bit today.

Florin, thanks for joining us. Yeah, thank you both for having me. Excited. Awesome.

Thank you. Glad Adam got to join. He has nothing to do with picking the guests, but I have to stop being demeaning to Dale. Hey, Florin, thanks for joining.

Um, so you've been all over the spectrum from like SDR to AE to running teams. Um, and we talk a lot about the go-to market gap, which in our world is, you know, a lot of stabilization and making sure people have the right functions and uh functions and people in the right place to do the right things. Since you've been through that whole uh process, what makes a good salesperson? Like, like when you're trying to find that right salesperson, what makes that person like, I have to have that person on my team?

Yeah. I mean, I think it depends a little bit, uh, I I would segment it out into different roles because I don't think necessarily what makes a great like prospect or an SDR makes a great AE. Uh, at the SDR level, I think it's it's a few things. One, I actually really like people that have some kind of like chip on their shoulder.

Uh, I tend to find that they're willing to like no matter what there is thrown at them, they're willing to like get themselves out of that situation. So, you might not have the best territory, but like you're going to find a way to do it. Um, another big one on the SDR side for me and when we interview is curiosity. So it's like, are you naturally curious and willing to understand what a buyer or a prospect or a specific industry is focused on?

Uh, and I think that one's like very difficult to to teach. You can try to teach it with like, hey, here's like the great questions to ask in a discovery or whatever, but it's like, I've noticed that sustaining curiosity over time is almost something that's like inherent to a person. Right. You can't teach it.

Yeah, it's it's it's tough. I'm trying to figure it out. How do you how do you screen for it though? Uh, so a few different ways, like for example, when we send over uh one of the portions of the SDR interview is actually doing like an assignment.

Uh, I'm actually looking for candidates to ask clarifying questions. Like sometimes the assignment's almost like a little bit vague. Yeah. Just to see if they're willing to uh dive a little bit deeper.

And honestly, the biggest tell for me actually and I'm constantly disappointed, uh, is the type of questions that people just ask at the end of the interview. Yeah. Yeah. That's always that's that's my biggest part of the interview.

Like I'll leave 15 minutes at the end or 20 minutes at the end and I'll if they don't ask good questions, like it's a no-go for me. I'm still shocked to this day. It's like there's so much uh so many resources like you have even chat GPT. Like you can find 10, show me 10 uncommon questions to ask, but like you'll have so many candidates that'll ask one question or even I'd probably say 20% of candidates are like, no, like I've I don't have any questions for you and it's just like very.

That's crazy, right? Yeah. No questions. I want the job, but I I I don't have one single question for you.

But it happens all the time. Yep. So, I I agree with you, hiring SDRs, hiring AEs, hiring sales leaders, all different profiles. Um, having worked with, you know, as an SDR, as an AE, and as a sales manager, when you look at like the different stages.

Yeah. Where where do you start? Because like and what I mean by that is a lot of founders we talk to are like, oh, we're just going to get SDRs. But the unit economics, in my opinion, have to make sense.

Yeah. In your mind as someone who's leading SDR teams, when do you need SDRs, when do you need full cycle AEs? Uh, so I'm a pretty big believer that you need uh I think like if you were to hire a certain persona first, it would be the account executive. But before you even hire sales people, uh and this is something that my founders at my first company Lupio did very well.

They actually closed like the first 50 deals themselves. Uh, and that brought us to I joined as the first like salesperson. I was an SDR at like 400k in ARR. Um, and a lot of that was actually we had a lot of like inbound.

So it was me like qualifying people out for the founders and then shortly after two AEs came along to like really build out that process. The the main thing that you should not do is not hire sales people and specifically SDRs before you have product market fit. Like as a general rule of thumb, I probably Can we scream that from the rooftops, please? Yeah.

So generally No salesperson is going to get you product market fit. Yeah. If you're literally just asking uh and usually some more entry level person to like figure something out that is not You can't figure out. Yeah.

So uh that's my advice. Probably at least a million in ARR uh now. Yeah. Yeah, and and and through that process, um, I I wonder if if we're all talking about product market at the same.

So a lot of times we're talking to founders or CEOs or CROs. Like we have product market fit and then like you look at it and it's like, well, the hundred customers you have, like 98% of them are all your network or something that referred to you. Like you haven't done any outbound motion, like you don't know how to bring in someone cold. Like it's great if you are if you have a great network and leverage your network, but how do you actually bring in deals outside of what's what what you know in your network?

Yeah, one hundred percent. And and we find that a lot. Um, so moving off move like so we have to do a lot of hiring for clients or like we we do an evaluation of their team. Then once we kind of get that going, we have to build out a lot of foundational elements.

And then in that foundational element, one of the things I find super interesting about Common Room is like you guys are making connections for people in that process. Um, how can people as they're building out their foundational go-to market leverage something like Common Room to help them find uh better relationships, build more top of funnel? Like talk to talk to me talk to me a little bit about that. Uh, so this is actually kind of interesting.

I I don't think Common Room is actually built for people to find product market fit. And I this is one of the things that we figured out as we were finding our own product market fit. We work a lot better with companies that uh are are larger, have uh buyers that are leaving digital breadcrumbs and essentially already have product market fit. So we're not going to really help you find that.

Uh, I think like early stages to find product market fit, there's other platforms where you know, you have like the Clays of the world, for example, um, where you're building more like outbound style lists and uh trying different types of messages uh and use cases to various personas to test like what's actually working and talking to various like buyers in the market. But yeah, we're we're not like really focused on that early stage. Awesome. Yeah, it wasn't about early stage.

So, in foundation, what we're doing with a lot of our clients, like our clients would range from like they have they they may need product market fit which we're helping them with, but have product market fit. But, um, once we stabilize a lot of the companies, like they're not bleeding anymore, the chaos has stopped. Like you're kind of getting into some momentum. Like we we talk about momentum.

Um, then we get into the foundational side of it and it's like, what are the technologies and uh infrastructure you need to build that foundation? And that's where I think like you've made initial conversations you you've had initial conversations, you're starting an outbound motion, but you need to find a way to start scaling that. Like, what are those foundational elements in the tech stack? So it could be your CRM, could be your uh call recording technology.

Like, is Common Room a foundational platform to help people make those connections and build that top of funnel pipeline? Yeah. Uh, one hundred percent. So, I can even give you like an uh an analogy that one of my HCR came up with.

But essentially like what we do is we help you uh fish in a pond as opposed to like the ocean. So, I think that the fundamental thing that's like really changed in the last 10 years of prospecting, um, before you used to have like the these platforms like Sales Loft and Outreach, where you didn't have the technology to know like who was in market. Like you had a few different signals that you could uh kind of leverage, but now you have technology that really is integrated into all of the web and you can see the digital breadcrumbs that uh people are leaving. Before, you never had that.

So, what you had to do with what I'm calling like outbound 2.0 cuz before 2.0 was just like, you know, sending emails and and calling manually. Uh, you had like a TAM or a SAM and you were like, okay, I don't know who's interested right now, but I'm going to send 10,000 emails and I'm likely going to hit the 10% that are in market.

It's not super efficient, but it was much more efficient than going manual. Now, what uh technologies like Common Room allow you to do is we can actually show you who is in market or like starting to display intent, so that you're not even wasting time on uh, you know, that I'm not I'm going to say like 70% of people that are like, uh, either not in market or not even in the process of being educated on that specific thing. Hmm, interesting. You're good, Dale?

I I like it I like it I like it when you have to ponder. I have to think I have to think on that one a little bit. I like it. So, Yeah.

It I want to double down on this because outbound has changed, right? Prospecting has changed and you talked about SalesLoft and Outreach and there's all sorts of tools that I truly believe have ruined prospecting because all they encourage you to do and we we hear it from our clients all the time and even newer tools, Smart Lead, Instantly. And I think Clay's great if used properly, but let's throw Clay in there for purpose of this conversation. Just go find a bunch of people who are in your ICP that you haven't redefined in 10 years.

Um, drop them in Clay, enrich them, make sure the email is accurate. Um, and blast out 100,000 emails. Um, and I do think SalesLoft and Outreach proliferated this and people are still doing this. Yeah.

What is the right way and let's put Common Room aside for a moment. But what is the right way to prospect? Because I'm a big believer that like that's a lot of effort for less than a one percent reply rate. Um, and that's a numbers game that Sure, sales is numbers, but is that the best way to prospect?

What is the right way to prospect? Yeah. So first of all, I actually think it starts with like really being able to define like your ICP and building a proper list. I think most people overestimate how big their So, TAM is one thing, like your total addressable market.

Sure. Your SAM, which is like what companies can are actually going to buy from you? I think that's like a a big distinction that a lot of founders and people are not really making. Like, even for us cuz we just went through this list building process right now for a new fiscal year.

Like, there are about 1,500 accounts in North America, or like at least global organizations that are like perfect fits for us. Sure. That's it. Small.

Uh, which is uh, you know, technically, we could probably sell to 100,000 plus companies, but it's like we're going to be so inefficient with a lot of those and the message and the product is just not going to be uh, as successful for them. So it's like that's a problem not just for uh, sales, but further down the line. Like it's going to be churn issues and like there's so many different companies that have have dealt with this, right? It's like you'll get to one to three million ARR and you think you're you have product market fit, but people are churning in a year.

Uh, so you're not actually product market fit. And that's, I think, because sales functions tend to, uh, I mean, there's pressure to close deals, but you're not closing the right deals. And back to the definition of like what is really product market fit, right? Yeah, you may be bringing people in the door, but if you got the hole in the boat, like, do you really have product market fit?

And like we've all gone a lot of people have gone through the you're just getting people in the door, you got to drive revenue, you got to understand and but learn and go through that process, but also understand like you don't have product market fit. And if you're going to get investment, like be clear with the investor. Look at, we're at two and a half million in ARR. We have we have a churn problem because we brought in a lot of customers, but now we know our product market, like we know our ICP, we know we're going to niche down into this.

Yes, you want to know the TAM is 450,000 billion trillion dollars, but like what we're going to deliver is really niched here and then we'll grow on top of it and we'll build on top of it. And I think investors are starting to get there. 100%. And I can give you a bit of like an anecdotal story.

I won't name the company, but one of the companies I worked at, we were at 5 million in ARR and we actually did not have product market fit. We found out later because the company imploded, but we closed a lot of deals over a year period and then the churn was like insane, uh, the year after. So you actually should if you're going to grow heavily, you should actually wait a year to see if like you actually have full product market fit. Does it stick?

It's difficult to do because if you're growing so fast, like you want to overinvest in the sales team and SDRs and all that kind of stuff. So, hindsight is always going to be 20/20. I'm not blaming the founders for that at all, but uh, it was just an interesting lesson for me. People buy from people.

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com. So you you said something that I I want to go back to. Um, you can sell to a lot of people, but it doesn't mean it's the right people. And Dale and I talk about this all the time with founders where it's like, oh, you know, customer success sucks and they're not doing their job and we have all this churn.

But where does it start? It starts with whether you're selling to the right people or not. And I think we're so focused on TAM, we could sell to everyone, right? Like I have this little thing that might work for you, but 10 other things won't and you're going to wind up churning.

I'm dealing with this with a client right now. They're very focused on retained executive search. But their solution could sort of work for contingency, but we know that those people churn in a year. Why is it so hard to get founders or even let's say CROs to understand that like not all revenue is good revenue?

Because that takes you, when we talk about the go-to market gap, you think that you have this repeatability to your point because you have sold $5 million in ARR, but shit, we need to go back to stabilization because we have a leaky bucket that's going to kill us. Yeah. I mean, I not to sound too meta, but I think it goes back to the human condition of like we want short-term like gains and stuff. And I think that's actually exasperated by uh like VC funded companies.

You're just like there's so much pressure to get to the next ARR target that uh you just have to have to kind of deal with that. I want to I want to call I'm an advising company called Hyperbound, it's two very young founders. They actually only started exactly one year ago. They're over uh a million in ARR right now.

They did something uh two months after they launched. They did something that I think is like extremely wise. Uh I made a post for them that ended up with like a few million impressions. It booked them like 300 plus demos.

They made a call at one point where we're like, we are not going to even have a conversation with anybody that doesn't have a sales team of at least 15 people. And they like completely canceled like 250 demos. And that's like pretty nuts to be able to do. But they but more companies should do this in my opinion.

It's how you do it. You don't just cancel and say F off, but like, Florin, thank you so much. We have uh, Hockey Stack is another one that does a really good job at this. If you are not truly enterprise, you might love us.

You might think we're great. At the end of a year, at the end of three months, at the end of six months, we're not going to be the best fit and you're going to churn. So rather than that, this is who you should go talk to. Um, for your time.

And when you get to the right space, we would love to have a conversation with you. Um, and I think you earn so much credibility by doing that. Um, our world is a little different, but we do that in our world as well, right? Like you're just not a good fit and I don't want to just take your money.

Um, so I love that they do that. Yeah. And one of the first things I did at Common Room when I joined back in May, I uh implemented Chili Piper. I was like, SDRs not going to do any type of discovery or any like it's going straight to AEs.

And then we just segmented off is like employees under 50, um, just are not routed to AEs. You go to an interactive demo and uh there's someone that's filtering through them. Like there are a few smaller companies that might make sense for us if they're displaying enough uh signal in their market, like a PLG company is perfect, for example. Yeah.

And that's kind of it. But the the message or the path that they take from Chili Piper is not, hey, like you're not good enough or whatever. It's like, hey, here's like you can take a free trial, here's an interactive demo, so you're still actually showing them the product, but we're not going to spend time uh sending that to an account executive. And that's just like a business decision that we made.

Yeah. Yeah. Super interesting. And I I think uh so you said something earlier that I find interesting when you're hiring SDRs.

But I'm curious your perspective on this because I I hear it a lot and I I believe it a I believe it. But do you have this path of SDRs to an AE role? So almost using your SDR as like a bullpen for lack of a better terms, like a baseball term, or like a a AAA team that can generate back into an AE role. And and what are you seeing nowadays that SDRs are like, I've done this for six months and I want to now be an AE.

Like what's that time frame that they're thinking about? Six months, that's a long time. Yeah. So, as someone that's went from an SDR to an AE at my first company and uh to a manager, I'm a very big believer that uh it's important to have like a a bullpen to get to uh an AE.

And what we found at my first company Lupio, uh the top SDRs that became AEs were actually like the probably like the within the top 10% of AEs at uh the company. And I think it's for a number of different reasons. Like you don't have to retrain them. Uh they already know how to prospect and self source pipeline, which I think is a huge thing in that market to that buyer.

Um, and right now I'm literally at Common Room over the next couple of days. I'm building out the career pathing because I want to I love it. I want to feed SDRs into our commercial team. I think the thing that's tough, uh, SDRs that are at companies that only sell enterprise, I tend to find that the jump from an SDR to an enterprise AE is very difficult to make and it's tough to build a career path there for them.

So, I I don't have a perfect answer in that type of world. But if you do have an SMB or a commercial team, I think like you you should be have a feeder system, for sure. Uh-huh. And then in terms of like timing, I actually think it's a bit more of an employer's market again.

Like and the expectations have uh chilled out a little bit. Most people or SDRs now kind of realize you have to be in role for one, one and a half, two years and it's becoming more common. It's just like it is what it is. Uh, a lot of companies are leaning down, right?

Like you it's rare to see 100 person SDR team, uh, even like a 25 person SDR team for like a company under 500 people. So, uh, there's just not as many opportunities. Yeah. And I I appreciate that that insight for sure.

Yeah. It's there's this sense of entitlement, right? That I think folks used to have of and listen, we as an industry created it. Um, oh, you've been here six months, here's your promotion.

Um, oh, you've been here a month, sit on sales calls so you could get promoted. Yes, you should sit on sales calls. You should sit on sales calls to learn. It shouldn't be, oh, so you could get promoted.

Yeah. And I don't think it's about um doing your time or like putting a deadline on it, but at the end of the day, you have to learn and they're very different. I agree with what you said and I don't think enough people talk about it that going from SDR to enterprise AE like in a full enterprise motion, those are wildly different skill sets. Um, and most enterprise orgs are not going to be able to train you to do that.

Yeah. Um, you have to be transparent with people about that up front. Yeah. I also think like there was a bit of a shock for me to even going to uh from team lead, SDR to an AE role, because it's like you you're on calls here and there, like if you've listened to demos.

You're like, oh, I know the prospect, I know the pains. But I think the thing that a lot of people don't fully internalize is how many different uh possible situations there are in a sales cycle, especially if it's like a sales cycle that's not like, you know, two days or two weeks. It's like at Lupio, the average sales cycle, even commercial was what? Uh, it was about three months.

So you have From Lupio, the RFP company? Exactly. Oh, very cool. I we have a client that uses them.

Nice. So you have like there's the demo, uh, there's discovery, there's demo, there's like negotiation, you have to run POCs, you have to run like trial check-ins, you have to run negotiation calls. Uh, and there's so many different variables of things that could happen in all those different types of calls. Uh, that make it much the learning curve is just going to take a little bit longer.

Like when you're an SDR, don't get me wrong. It's a very difficult thing to do, but it's like there's kind of like five things that could really happen in like a discovery or an email exchange uh or a basic cold call, right? For all the for all the SDRs out there, like they're probably like everyone if they're listening, they're like, I want to be Florence like I want to get to that place. Like what's the piece of advice you have for them like as they're starting their career as an SDR?

Maybe they've never sold before. To get to an account executive? No, to get to where you are. Ah.

Uh, so, I I don't like the I don't like saying uh things sometimes are just like end up being lucky because I think you can uh influence luck a little bit. But one of the main things that like really blew up my career was working for a company that ended up like growing really fast. So at Lupio I had like five or six promotions in seven years. That's awesome.

Uh, VCs and other founders have a very difficult time picking winners. So I wouldn't try too hard to pick a winner. Uh, if I had to do it again, I would probably actually recommend that you go to like a large corporation that has a great training system in place. Yep.

Get the brand behind you and then uh go and work for like these other types of companies. Um, and it's kind of ironic that I'm giving that advice because I I didn't do that. Um. Yeah, but you have the wisdom you have the wisdom of what you would do if you had to redo it.

Yeah. That that was that's like the sure path in my eyes. Uh, this other path is more risky, but it's more reward. So it's like it depends what kind of person you are.

I've always been more of an entrepreneurial type of person. Um, so I I took a shot. Love that. Love that.

So, we've talked a little bit about how outbound is changing. It's going to continue to change. What are your predictions? What are we going to see, dare I say for the next year?

Um, I don't know if we could predict past the next. Next three months too. Uh, I was going to say, I don't know if we could predict past the next quarter or two. Um, but what are we going to see?

What's going to change? Yeah, there's a lot of stuff is changing. So, we talked about the problem that like uh the outreach and salesloft of the world created. And I I don't want to hate on them because I I still I'm a outreach customer and they did a lot for like the sales uh industry.

And it's just like naturally things evolve it is what it is. The 10X problem is now AI SDRs, which is like outbound uh outreach and salesloft on crack. I have so many thoughts. So, we actually considered building an AI SDR at uh Common Room.

But, uh we ended up not deciding not to go that way and we kind of changed our approach to believing that sales is fundamentally human, at least for now. And we want to use AI to uh essentially be like your your Iron Man. Uh sorry, your the Jarvis to your Iron Man is like the phrase I used. So, it's kind of this idea of like the co-pilot, right?

It's like, I have all the data and you can just give me recommendations. So for us what that looks like, because we're listening for for various signals and can give you a POV on accounts. Uh, the future to me is like, hey, here your here's your book of business of, you know, your top 100 accounts. Here's the signals that are displaying.

Here's the two that you should focus on today. Here's your best best path of entry in this account and all the digital footprints that were left, um, that give you the highest propensity chance to like book that meeting, uh, or like as an AE, you know, focus on that. So I think um, the next year is going to be like this co-pilot. You have AI agents that help you do like the mundane tasks that uh sales people used to do.

Um, the future I it's very like past one, two years, I really don't know. Like it's very difficult to say, like stuff is evolving so fast. It's hard. It's uh, it'll it'll be interesting to see.

I hate AI SDRs. Um, that's a whole separate conversation that we don't need to spend our time, uh, chatting about. All right, Florin, let's do some rapid fire before we wrap it up. So much good stuff shared.

I cannot wait to see, uh, where outbound goes. Early bird or night owl? Uh, I'm a night owl. If you weren't Sorry?

If you weren't if you weren't in tech, where what like trade or or process would you would you work? Uh, well, so I started in like banking. So I went to business school and I just like hated it off the bat. So, um, I ended up in tech sales.

If uh money didn't matter, I don't know. I'd probably just be like a like a captain on a yacht or something. Oh, I love it. Love it.

What is um, what's your favorite guilty pleasure snack? I love these um, smart sweets. Uh, I don't know if you guys have those in the US. Maybe it's like a Canadian thing.

But it's like low low calorie like sour candies or uh salt and vinegar chips, which I also think is not really an American thing. Ooh. Salt and vinegar. My my my kid loves, loves salt and vinegar chips.

Um, not my thing. Yeah. It's not a thing in the US, right? Uh, it is.

It is. It is? Okay. I haven't cuz uh maybe it depends on state.

Maybe Florida because you guys are influenced by Canada a little bit there. so soberg's down there. Um, Lots of Ontario plates. Yeah, exactly.

Uh, but I noticed since a lot of states like it just does not exist. Or is it chips, maybe? Awesome. As we wrap this up, where's your uh dream vacation destination?

Uh, my I've been a lot of countries already, like almost 70, but uh, the place I haven't been that I is my dream next is Japan. Ah. Very nice. A lot of people have said that recently and I was just reading an article Florin that it's actually the cheapest, uh, one of the cheapest places to go to.

Yeah. Well, the Japanese Yen is, I think, down in uh current uh in um relative cost to like the USD. Uh, and and Canadian dollar too. So, uh, every single person that's been to Japan has told me that it's amazing.

I've never heard a bad thing about it. Hmm. Ever. Cool, man.

Awesome. Florin, thank you so much for joining. Y'all go check out Common Room, uh, and we're glad that you spent some time with us. Yeah, thank you both so much.

Thank you. Appreciate it. Cheers.