What IS RevOps? 🤔 ft. Sid Kumar | Revenue Reimagined Ep. 024

In this episode, Sid Kumar explains that RevOps is far more than just Sales Ops 2.0; it acts as the COO of the go-to-market engine. By stitching together marketing, sales, and customer success, RevOps creates a seamless buyer journey and breaks down departmental silos before they become deeply entrenched. Sid emphasizes that passive 'alignment' is no longer enough—teams need intentional, cross-functional collaboration driven by a shared language and common customer outcomes. He also challenges the traditional 'set and forget' annual planning cycle, advocating instead for an agile, monthly review cadence. This approach allows revenue leaders to identify which initial assumptions were incorrect and pivot resources quickly, ensuring the company adapts in real-time to changing buyer behaviors without waiting for the new fiscal year. Finally, Sid highlights the evolving focus of RevOps, noting a recent disproportionate emphasis on Customer Success and integrated demand. He argues that data shouldn't entirely replace a sales leader's gut instinct; rather, it should provide the 'breadcrumbs' and signals necessary to ask better questions and accurately forecast end-to-end business health.

Discussed in this episode

• Viewing RevOps as the COO of go-to-market rather than a reactive support function.
• Moving from passive alignment to active, intentional collaboration across marketing, sales, and CS.
• Why implementing RevOps at the one million dollar revenue mark is already too late.
• The crucial differences between reactive Sales Ops and proactive, holistic RevOps.
• Structuring the go-to-market organization into a unified 'Flywheel' reporting to a Chief Customer Officer.
• Transitioning from rigid annual planning to an agile, monthly go-to-market review process.
• Balancing quantitative data signals with qualitative gut instincts from sales leaders.
• Using AI to handle undifferentiated heavy lifting and boost overall sales productivity.

Episode highlights

1. 0:00 — Introducing Sid Kumar
2. 1:20 — RevOps as GTM COO
3. 3:15 — Alignment vs. true collaboration
4. 5:45 — Sales Ops vs. RevOps
5. 8:00 — HubSpot's flywheel org structure
6. 10:30 — Agile monthly planning cadence
7. 13:00 — AWS territory disruption lesson
8. 16:20 — Allocating RevOps resources
9. 19:00 — Ideal backgrounds for RevOps
10. 22:15 — Data vs. sales intuition

Key takeaways

• RevOps is the COO of your go-to-market engine.
• Alignment is passive; collaboration requires true intentionality.
• RevOps is proactive and holistic, not Sales Ops 2.0.
• Shift from rigid annual planning to agile monthly GTM reviews.
• Use data as breadcrumbs to validate qualitative sales instincts.

Transcript

It's it's never it it never ends up being a third a third a third. It just never is, right? It's always where do you find opportunities to go find tune the engine? Or where do you need to go double down and pay a lot more attention.

Welcome back to another episode of the revenue reimagine podcast. We are so humbled to have with us today the one and only Sid Kumar, who is the SVP of Rev Ops at Hubspot, former field sales leader at AWS, probably, in my opinion, one of the best of the best in the Rev up space who can truly talk to founders and revenue leaders about what it takes to build properly from the ground up, and you also have this guy Dale next to me. Sid, thanks for joining us, man. Great to be here.

Look forward to the chat. Yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly. Okay, so we'll start with a little bit of controversy. We are revenue reimagined.

So, uh, you can't take uh, you can't be a revenue operations leader anymore. You got to do something else in the go-to market strategy. What would you be and and why? Uh, if I would be a chief, you know, you talk about the chief go-to market officer, right?

Dale, you talk a lot about that. I think about this as the COO of go to market. So, I think it COO of go to market. That's how I think about RevOps.

And and why would and why would you pick that would you pick that over marketing or CS or Well, it goes back to connect the connected go to market. If you're not truly connected across your go to market, you're just delivering marketing, sales, customer success. And I I think we've seen that playbook just not work. And RevOps has become that architect of that What is that buyer's journey look like and how are you going to orchestrate your engine behind it to go go deliver the the CX that you need to.

I love that. So, let let's double down on that for a little, right? Like there's a lot of startups that we work with that function in silos. And to your point, you have sales over here, CS over here, marketing over here.

And I think at least in my experience with startups, RevOps is kind of like this afterthought of like, yeah, this is like cool, but maybe when we hit a million dollars. And like I'm a big believer like that's wrong. Talk to me when you talk about the COO of bringing it together. Like, how do you make sure and why is it important to have RevOps early?

Because a million dollars is way too fucking late. It's it is way too late. It's I mean, as soon as you start generating revenue and you start generating and start delivering product to the market, you're quickly going to start getting functionally siloed. And you're going to start, you know, doing marketing activities, whether you have a CMO or not, you're going to start doing marketing, you're going to start closing deals.

You're going to start to figure out how to go support those deals. That's that's RevOps in its infancy because you have a a full customer life cycle to go look at versus maniacally focusing just on the funnel and looking at are you closing those deals? And I think that's it's less about the organization and more about are you are you delivering end-to-end value to customers? Are you thinking about how they learn about your product, how they're actually going to buy it, and how are you supporting them through renewal, expansion, loyalty.

So, I think it's a concept more than anything and a process. During during your career, what's the easiest way you've seen to get alignment super quickly in the like what tactics, what processes have you run that have been successful? Because we talk we talk alignment a lot and we don't see it happen very often. Yeah, that's a it's a great question.

And I think it I think there's a shift from like alignment to true collaboration and communication, right? Alignment feels a bit passive. It's like, yeah, we'll we'll get along and we'll go you know, pretend we're working together. And look at this guy.

I kind of get along with them. I I I I actually and I Dale's normally the one to interrupt, but I'm going to interrupt. I I love what you just said. Alignment is passive.

Alignment and collaboration are two very different things. I could tell you, hey, great. Sid, we're aligned. And then I go off and do my own damn thing.

And then I'm pissy at what you do. Collaborating on it. Keep keep going cuz Dale interrupted you. But like very different.

No, it's it's it's the intentionality of it, right? Are you bought in to the fact that you need to work with your your counterparts, whether it's whatever combination of marketing, sales, and customer success it is, to deliver the best outcome for your customers and for your company. And it goes back to how how do you convince people in functions to to play well together? I think it's identifying what is that common objective?

Do we all care about the success of our customers? Are we solving for the success of our customers? Do we agree? Great.

If we do that, do we agree that revenue and all these lagging indicators will accrue as a result of doing great things for our customers and and then you start to break down the the silos a bit. Then you start to say, okay, well marketing, you're looking at MQLs or you're looking at leads. That doesn't translate to pipeline. Let's figure out how do we create a common language between sales and marketing and looking at what are those processes that are like team sports, that need to be team sports.

Um, Deman Gen is the oldest team sport, but now you look at sales and CS, then you look at the role of marketing and CS. You start to look at where do they need to be starting to really play as a single team and then 1 + 1 = 3 for the customer and then both functions are delivering more value and outcome for for the companies as as a result. That's how I think about it. And and I I think that makes a ton of sense.

You know, when you look at RevOps, you sit at the middle, right? Of call it marketing, sales, CS, and it's your role, or the RevOps team role, better said, to stitch it all together. But inevitably, what I've seen happen is RevOps is misconstrued as sales ops. And now I'm calling you as my SVP of RevOps and asking you to stitch together a Hubspot, not Salesforce report.

Um, and put it together, but that's not We we use Hubspot. We love it. Um, Thank you. Thank you.

Thank you. That's That's not what RevOps is. Talk to me about the transition that we've seen over the years from sales ops. I don't know why it's giving me a thumbs up.

From sales ops to RevOps. And what the difference is? Yeah, it's a it's a great it's a great question. And I think Notice he just said my question was great.

This is a great question. You're wearing a suit today. I mean, you you got to dress up for it. I mean, anything you say when you're wearing a suit is just, you know, it's got to be good, anything coming out of your mouth.

Then you got the You got the thumbs up from AI too. I I think, um, it's a it's a great question because it's if you think about sales ops, it's RevOps is not sales ops 2.0. And I think that's really important to realize.

So sales ops, you think about as more reactive and and doing the things that a sales leader needs or believes they need in order to do their job more effectively. Whereas I look at RevOps as it's revenue. So, what are all the components of your go to market that generate revenue? How do you take that holistic end-to-end view of it?

So, number one is scope, right? So it's not just sales, it's one component of it. But I think the other is it's being much more proactive, helping see around corners. How are you a business partner?

Like the business partnership is is really where I think the difference is. It's a it is your CROs or CCOs, whatever you call it in your org, like they're sidekick. How are you jointly making business decisions together? Kind of like the COO concept that I was sharing earlier.

So, you're making those day in and day out trade-offs together, you're looking at execution together, you're thinking about how do you go after that TAM over a three to five year period together. So it's a it's a lot of strategy, it's a lot of execution, and it's everything in between. So I think you need a really great communicator that's able to build those relationships and really be that as I said, service that connective tissue across your go to market functions. So, where does RevOps fit in your organization?

Like where does it report into? Does it like report into a sales leader? Does it report into the CEO? Does it report Like, Hubspot may be a little bit different because you guys are a little bit bigger.

But as we because we have a lot of startups, a lot of founders. Like where when they're starting to think about RevOps, where would it sit and why? Yeah, I'll tell you how it's structured here and then I'll give you my broader point of view on it. Uh here we have we brought all of our go-to-market team into one organization called the Flywheel.

We did this about three years ago. And we brought together marketing, sales, customer success. And then the fourth pillar was we created RevOps about three years ago. So, RevOps is the fourth pillar.

All four of these orgs report to our chief customer officer. Okay. So, it is a it's just part of the go-to-market organization. And I I I tend to like that.

I tend to like it as close to the customer and to the go-to-market as possible. So, and that can mean different things in different companies. And and not at arm's length from from the truth or the ground truth. And and that's that's where again, it could mean different things in different places, but I think close to the close to the action.

So you understand it's it's part data, but a lot of it's art. You know, you're really thinking about the art of like customer sentiment, partner sentiment, staying close to that, that informs your strategy, helps you fine tune your execution and just stay agile. Because the other the other point I'd make is we've been in a world of like, you know, set and forget type of planning. Yes.

We're in this annual planning, you know, and budgets and OpEx get released and then it's like, okay, January 1. Like that's not how customers think. That's not how buyers buy. And and I think we have to get if you're in an MRR business, you got to be thinking, you know, daily, weekly, monthly, quarterly, maybe, like, you know, just shorten the time frame and saying, is there new information that causes me to revisit my beliefs?

And and keeping that agility on execution, resource allocation now, I think is super important right now. How do you drive that mindset shift? Because you're right. You know, I think even like I'm thinking of a company that we're working with right now that is very much, you know, selling to SMBs, very much focused on MRR.

Um, but planning is like, all right, it's December. We got to plan for January and build out our what what Adam Dale, what's the headcount going to be for the year? What's the revenue target for the year? Um, and we ask like, when was the last time you guys looked at this?

Oh, we looked at it December of last year. You missed your target by 86%. I'm a little confused. How do you shift that mindset from this annual planning to looking at it in a more agile, more frequent manner, and is it RevOps that drives that?

Or is that coming from someplace else in the org? Yeah, I I I think it is I think I think RevOps can be the catalyst that does that. And and Hubspot, what we we started doing especially coming out of coming out of the pandemic and the past three, four years have been anything but normal, right? Any given month has its you're like looking at it and saying like, you know, what do I think about the month and what does it mean relative to my assumptions before?

We put an agile planning mindset in place. So, every month we get together, you know, probably about a week into the month and use it as a go-to-market forum. And I know Sangram is big on this, right? It's are you having go-to-market meetings or are you having sales or marketing or CS?

We we have a go-to-market meeting and say, we had these assumptions before in our plan when we did this, you know, back in Q4. Where were we right? Where do we not know? And where have we potentially got it wrong?

And it's not to be knee-jerk and start, you know, moving things around for the sake of moving things around. You need trends, right? You need a three points at least to go make a trend. But it's starting to get out ahead of what are those signals you're getting around changing buyer behavior, changing, um, partner behavior, user behavior.

So, like are do you have more data points that give you reason to think you should revisit your assumptions? And then be okay, just saying you were wrong or you were partially right. That's the biggest thing you have to overcome is like not holding this it's like a it's like a it's got to be a living, breathing thing where you have you have a plan and it's as good as it is when you do it, right? And you got to be okay revisiting the assumptions.

So I think that's a top-down mindset shift. And Dale's having an epiphany here. Well, I was just thinking about failures. Like you were talking about like being okay with your failures.

So I was curious because RevOps is not new, but like as you've grown up through RevOps, what what's one of the failures that you had that you learned from that were like an epiphany for you that you were like, oh, I did this wrong and I have to fix it moving forward. Yeah, yeah, you know, this was this was back in AWS. Um, I I remember this this time where we had come into the year organizing the territories a a certain way. You know, we came into the year, had a big quota to go allocate across a number of of regions and territories.

And we realized about a third of the way through the year, there were a couple of verticals that were really getting traction. Uh, with a specific offering. And we said, we could wait another nine months to go reorganize territories, which is super disruptive in the middle or even after you just kicked off the year. But we're like, look, given how fast things are moving right now, nine months is like a lifetime.

Right. So, we we did that was an example where we said, let's go cluster it. And by and by the way, we were further convicted by the end of that year and we then had an opportunity to go double down on that. And it was it was a disruptive bet.

It was a lot of pain for the RevOps team. I'll tell you that much. But it was the right business decision and it was an example of saying we got something wrong and we paid attention to a signal and and pivoted. Ever feel like keeping your CRM updated with call notes is a nightmare?

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Yeah. Yeah, it's it's funny, so many people are unwilling to accept failure or unwilling to and failure is probably the wrong word. Unwilling to say, you know, we we need to re-evaluate this. We made a mistake.

Um, and it's that pride and that ego, right? That gets in the way of like, I said that these were going to be the territories and this is going to work. And by God, they're going to work. I I think it takes a certain personality and a certain mindset, um, to to do that.

So I I I love that you called that out. When you're balancing between Sid, sales, CS, marketing, um, everyone's, you know, especially when you have a centralized RevOps resource. Like, everyone's vying. Who's more important?

Okay, sorry. I was going to say it a little nicer than that. Um, everyone's vying for your time. Everyone's vying for your resources.

Who does typically get most of that allocation? Who's more important? Um, and how do you determine like where you're spending that that focus? Like for someone who's new in RevOps, like how do you decide what to focus on?

Yeah, it's it's never it it never ends up being a third a third a third. It just never is, right? It's always where do you find opportunities to go fine tune the engine? Or where do you need to go double down and pay a lot more attention.

I would say like in the past, call it, you know, 12 months or so, past year, uh, I've been spending a lot of time on CS. Just because I think this is an area that is is just fundamentally changing. I know there's a lot been written on this. Um, Jason Lemkin just posted something on this the other day.

But there's a lot of discussion around understanding customer value. And do you are you truly trying to go after what is driving value for your customers or just putting ratios of people against renewals. And I think that's it's an area that just like, you know, just double clicking two, three, four clicks deep. We've been spending a lot of time there around understanding customer use cases, the usage, the outcomes they're trying to drive, linking that back to what they bought.

So, that's an area I've been probably spending a disproportionate amount of time on. And then I would say between sales and marketing, the other area that I've been spending a bunch of time on is, um, just around thinking about integrated demand, right? Which is, I'm sure, you're spending a ton of time on. It's thinking about the evolving world of of demand and how do you think about a multi variable like, you know, demand equation when things that used to work a certain way, don't work the same way anymore and uh, you have to get creative about how you make sure the pie is is big enough at at any given point in time.

So, I think it depends on what the what you're trying to solve for. I I tell Dale all the time that what we used to do with just blast emailing people isn't the way to do it anymore. He doesn't listen. I I don't listen.

And I told him like he wore a jacket and like you he got a an auto boy. So, that's how that works. Gold star, gold star. Yeah, yeah.

Sid, when for someone to be successful in RevOps, where where do you find that that background comes from? Is it typically, you know, I don't know many people who are like, oh, I want to be I want to be in RevOps as a career. Like, do you find them coming in from sales, from CS, from marketing, from like a finance background? Like, those on your team, those that you might have mentored, like, where do they typically start?

And I ask and Dale teases me and tells me that I'm the RevOps arm of revenue reimagined. Like I I geek out on it, but like, I'm a sales guy at my core. Yeah. Yeah, I think it's a it's a lot of different areas.

I think there is a traditional cohort of, you know, folks that were in sales ops or marketing ops. Some companies have CS ops and then they become part of it. So they've been on that ops track. Finance is another um, another side of it where you're looking at it from a different lens, you're getting closer to I would say the just the the ground execution.

The other is I I I didn't have a RevOps background before AWS. I kind of got into RevOps almost a little bit by accident. I was running I mean more. I was running uh digital sales at CA.

So, you know, had had my quota, I had all all, you know, digital sales, demand gen. Yeah. All that stuff. And I just was like, I, you know, a lot of that was very operational.

It was operational sales, right? Operational sales and go to market. And I I really enjoyed the architecting of the go to market. It was like the first time I did lead to revenue at CA.

Did the same thing at AWS on a very different scale. And then, you know, round three is at Hubspot. You know, so really thinking about the connection of lead to revenue and then that close loop, like it's just I think if you can get it right or even partially right, it just pays a lot of dividends. So I I I came from a function, you know, I wouldn't call myself a career sales leader, but like I that's immediately where I came from, but what uh got me super excited was the ability to go say, all right, I understand how it works on the other side.

And being and having been in marketing, having been in sales, I ran a customer success group. So I had been in each of the three functions in some way before coming to RevOps. So it's how do you constantly help look at it from the other perspective. So you're helping a sales leader and a marketing leader talk the same language.

You're helping a CS leader talk the same language as sales and and and marketing. So, I think it's one of those three from a function traditional sales ops or or, you know, finance tends to be the other. You you just hit the nail on the head is you're helping everyone speak the same language. And that is what and gut check me here.

Um, that is what we see in a lot of these startups that we work with in our business get wrong is there's no one foundational language from, and I'm going to take it one step further, sales, marketing, success, product, everyone's talking this own different language and doesn't be able to bring it together. So I I love the way that you stitched that together. Um, and it's so important to start it earlier than than later. Yeah.

And I think a lot of it, so one of the things I was thinking about as you were talking and Sid, you were saying, RevOps seem very data driven. We do a lot of data pieces. And as a sales leader, as you know, when you're in sales, a lot of things become gut as well. You're like, I believe that deal's going to close.

I believe this is going to happen. How do you as a RevOps leader balance, like you know what the data is saying, but the sales leader is like, but I know this deal's going to close, and you're like, okay, but the data is saying something totally different over the last 18 months. Like, how do you balance that with the leaders? What what Dale's saying is when Dale tells you that a deal is going to close at the end of the month and I look at it and I'm like, we haven't spoken to this person in nine months.

It's not going to close. How do you balance that, Sid? Yeah, it's it's it's it's it's part data, as I said, part qualitative, part part uh, part art and science. Part art and science.

And I I think it's a like, here's what the data says. Tell me why you think the outcome is going to be different. And there could be an override that's qualitative. There's, you know, data is the signal or the breadcrumbs that lead you to go ask the questions.

Yeah. And and then the question you the answer you might get to the question be like, oh, okay, got it. So maybe you didn't log all your activities, Dale, in the uh, in the CRM. You're doing WhatsApp, you're doing text.

So you actually have been talking to the CEO and you're getting that you're getting that PO on the 31st. Fine, I'll get off your back. So I think if you you got to balance that, I think. So is data the leading indicator or the lagging indicator?

It could be both depending on what the data is. Like revenue is a lagging indicator, but what are the activities that Dale has done that lead me to believe that that lagging indicator or that deal closing is going to happen. Wow. So, I think you have to really think about I always think about north star metrics.

What is the north star metric? It might be revenue or or MRR. What are the activities, the engagements, the uh, customer verifiable outcomes that you can see that give you confidence that the lagging indicator is on its way or has has no chance of happening. Love that.

Yeah. Yeah. So, at revenue reimagine we always do give more than we get. And so you were gracious enough.

What are you going to provide to the audience? Sid. How about I do a uh consulting uh engagement for somebody who wants to pick my brain on on RevOps. What do you think about that?

I love that. I love it, but I want to clarify because our our audience while they're great, a consulting engagement does not mean Sid is going to spend the next three months with you at 10 hours a week. Sid is offering like 30, 45 minutes of his time to work with you, not a long-term engagement. Um, but I think that's a.

I think I I I started this by saying, you are one of the brightest minds in RevOps. Um, I don't know what an hour of your time goes for, but like that's a pretty pretty pretty big give and we appreciate that. Yeah, and I have to say like we're we're working with a customer right now and they thought they had a sales problem. And we went in, they had hubspot.

Whoever set up hubspot was totally broken. And we couldn't do anything before we fixed hubspot. So we're actually in the process of migrating, going through the process. So, the stuff that Sid can provide this person would be gold because it's not always a sales problem.

As Sangram always say, you have a go-to-market problem, which could be and in this case it was RevOps. Yeah. No, it's always it's always RevOps's fault. I mean, I I like that.

All right. Sid, can we do some rapid fire? Yeah, let's do it. All right.

I'm going to change it up. Oh, boy. True or false? If it's not in Hubspot, it doesn't exist.

True. True, true, true. I I say it all the time. If it's not in CRM, it doesn't exist.

Dale Dale, get your get your deals in there, Dale. Dale WhatsApping the CEO's executive assistant saying that he spoke to the CEO is false. Yeah, false. It's so If you had a crystal ball, what's one revenue trend that actually will become like a strategy in the next 12 to 18 months?

I mean, it's this is probably not a a crystal ball, but I I think just we haven't used the word AI once or the term AI once, which I'm pretty uh surprised about 30 minutes into this. I think the amount of uh that we're going to rely on AI as part of sales productivity a year from now is gonna shock all of us. You know, if we watch this a year from now, how much do we think we can take off of a rep's plate through the undifferentiated heavy lifting. It's it's kind of hard to believe.

Last year at this time, no one had ever heard of Chat GPT, you know, days, you know, November 30th and how much has happened. So, I think that's going to be the big big surprise here. Like like productivity is what is on top of everybody's mind right now. And everybody's tired after the past uh past two years, right?

Dale Dale writes everything on Chat GPT. So, um I'm going to stray instead of we're going to stray from rapid fire, cuz you're right. We didn't talk about AI, um, at all. From a RevOps perspective, how are you utilizing AI and where do you think that is going to go in the future?

Yeah, we're we're um, I mean, there we have our product teams that are spending a ton of time thinking about AI use cases within Hubspot for our customers, like like yourselves. What RevOps is doing is looking at uh automation and AI capabilities for productivity for our go-to-market teams. So, we put this under the umbrella of something called guided go-to-market. And And and what we've done is really look at let's go look at the entire buyer's journey.

And let's understand where are all the digital and human touch points that go and power that buyer's journey. And then where do we see opportunities for certain, you know, tasks, types of work that is lower value add but needs to be done, so that we can get more of rep time in front of customers and with partners and that's that's a big, big area that we're spending time on and and you know, RevOps is uh my team's heavily involved in driving the the the charge on that one. So. And Adam's actually AI, like cuz he doesn't Adam doesn't wear a suit.

So it's got to be AI. He's really AI. That's an avatar right there. There you go.

Hey, so earlier in the show, you said that you were going to be the COO, the go to market officer. It's tomorrow morning. What's the first thing you're doing as the uh COO? I'm I'm I'm waking up.

I'm going to have a cup of coffee in my hand and I'm going to look at the end-to-end health of my business across go to market. I'm not going to go just look at my pipeline report. Um, like Adam, he's a spreadsheet leader. Pipeline's good, but it's one aspect of Wow.

Wow. Throwing the shade. It's are you starting the day thinking about where in go to market should you be spending your time? And that the time you spend where you're spending it should be guided by where where things need your attention, right?

As opposed to diving right into deals and Yeah. leads and and so forth. So, yeah. But but that's where people's head normally goes, right?

Like every sales leader, almost even executive leader is like, oh, we we got to look at the pipeline. Where's the pipeline? Or what deals are going to close? That and to Dale's point with this customer we're working with, the deals aren't the problem.

Like that that's not the issue. Where is the issue? I I I love that you said that. Sid, thank you uh, thanks for spending half an hour with us, man.

I'm sorry you had to put up with him. Um, sorry AI. I'm sorry that I have to sit next to him. Um, but this is long long overdue.

Where um, where can people find you? Where could people find all the great advice that you put out there? Plug yourself, man. Yeah, you can you can find me uh, find me on LinkedIn.

We can send out a link uh as part of the post on this. You can find me on LinkedIn. That's probably where I spend most of my time learning about what's going on in go to market. Do do you do you post on X formerly known as?

I am a consumer of X, but I don't I don't really post on X. I've never posted on X once. Dale Dale loves him some Twitter. Yeah, it's it's one of those things that's I could doom scroll on Twitter, but uh or X, but nothing beyond that.

I love it. Sid, thank you so much for joining us, man. It was an absolute pleasure. Uh, guys, go follow Sid on LinkedIn.

For those of you that are using other CRM platforms, I have used them all. I'm not saying this cuz Sid's on the line. RR is powered by Hubspot. The majority of our customers are powered by Hubspot.

Go check out Hubspot. It is not just for SMBs anymore. Um, it could power your entire business. Sid, thanks so much, man.

Love it. Thank you both. Enjoy. Take care.