Does More Competition Mean MORE Growth Opportunity? ft. Alexa Grabell | Revenue Reimagined Ep. 041

Alexa Grabell, Co-founder and CEO of Pocus, joins the podcast to discuss building a category-defining tool in the crowded signal-based selling and PLG space. She unpacks her journey from testing the waters as a VC at Stanford to realizing her true passion lies in building and operating. Alexa provides a transparent look into how Pocus leverages a lean, highly adaptable team—where marketers close deals and a strong BizOps function plugs operational gaps—to scale efficiently without over-hiring. The conversation dives deep into the realities of product-led growth (PLG) versus sales-led motions, stripping away the buzzwords. Alexa explains why Pocus intentionally chose not to adopt a self-serve PLG model for their own product despite serving that exact market, a contrarian decision that ultimately saved them during an economic downturn. Finally, Alexa shares her 'delusional optimism' framework for embracing fierce competition and her 'ship and iterate' approach to product development. She also offers tangible advice for founders on handling VC relationships and navigating the fine line between accepting valuable feedback and knowing when to return 'gifts' of bad advice.

Discussed in this episode

• Transitioning from an aspiring VC to a dedicated founder by realizing a passion for operating.
• Treating VC funding as merely a means to build a multi-billion dollar company, rather than the end goal.
• Leveraging 'delusional optimism' to thrive in a hyper-competitive tech market.
• Defining the product-led growth (PLG) spectrum from fully self-serve tools to high-touch sales led models.
• Making the contrarian choice to avoid a self-serve model for Pocus despite serving PLG companies.
• Maintaining extreme team efficiency by hiring generalists and heavily leveraging a BizOps team.
• Empowering non-sales roles, like marketing, to actively sell products and connect with customers.
• Prioritizing rapid shipping and iteration over achieving product perfection for initial launches.

Episode highlights

1. 0:00 — Intro to Pocus and Alexa's data ops background
2. 2:15 — From Stanford VC fund to startup founder
3. 4:30 — Why VC funding is just a means to an end
4. 6:45 — Delusional optimism and embracing stiff competition
5. 9:10 — Buzzword-free definition of Product-Led Growth (PLG)
6. 11:30 — The contrarian decision to avoid PLG for Pocus
7. 14:00 — Scaling lean with generalists and a strong BizOps team
8. 17:15 — Balancing innovation with the ship and iterate mindset

Key takeaways

• VC funding is a tool, not the ultimate goal.
• Competition validates the market and confirms real demand.
• Not every SaaS product needs a self-serve PLG motion.
• Feedback is a gift you can choose to return.
• Cross-functional generalists are a superpower for early startups.

Transcript

We know how to kill competition. I don't know if that's PC to say. Um and we really know our customers. Um and if there's so much many competitors, to me that just tells me that's a huge market and a real need.

So if anything it gets me excited. Welcome back to another episode of the Revenue Reimagined podcast. I am stoked to have someone on the show that I have wanted to catch up with for a long time. Alexa Grable, the co-founder and CEO of Pocus, who is mission control for your pipeline.

What do they do? They bring together your product usage and other intense signals, customer, community, marketing data that lets you surface those top leads and ultimately enable your reps to act fast. Alexis's passion for democratizing data for go-to market teams began when she led sales, strategy and operations at Data Miner, where she built the internal solutions to power sales teams with what Dale and I talk about all the time, the only thing that matters, data. Alexa, thanks for joining the show.

Thanks for having me. I'm excited to be here. Yes, thank you for joining and I guess Adam's been wanting to catch up with you. We just met, so it's awesome to meet you.

Um, what we'd like to talk about a little bit when we start with our founders is, what was the origin story? Like, we talked a little bit about Data Miner, but what's the origin story of Pocus and like, why are you so passionate about it? Yeah, so when I was at Data Miner, I was building out something like Pocus today internally. We had data everywhere and I was thinking through ways on how can I use this data to help sales and CS teams and non-technical teams actually unlock that data to drive pipeline both in pre-sales and expansion.

Fast forward, I went back to school where I actually met my co-founder. And while we were there, we had this grand vision of how do you unlock data for go-to market teams? We then spent three months ideating on different ways to make that vision come true and different wedges into that world. And we actually took a class at Stanford called Lean Launchpad, where our professors help us incubate this idea.

And so we left the class three months later validating A, uh, the idea and the market, as well as B, that we wanted to continue working together as, you know, co-founders. I love that. Very cool. So, so it was born out of Stanford.

Yes, in a way. Correct. Okay. So, I'm I'm gonna go a little off script, but a lot of founders have started this founder journey and can't really articulate like, why, other than, oh, like I thought I had this really cool idea.

And it fascinates me. I was never one who wanted to be a founder, right? I always thought I would work for someone else, be it at a startup, or be it at a a larger company. And he still works for someone else.

He works for me, so it's all good. I I I mean, there's that too. I I E A. Um, but I I have always been fascinated by like, why did you want to go from, I don't wanna say a cushy job, but a guaranteed, you know, W-2 job, you have money, you probably had benefits, life was probably good to I'm gonna go try to build something in a hyper-competitive space and and deal with VCs and all of this.

Like, what made you say like, holy shit, I wanna do this? Great question. So the passion for the idea of building in this sales ops space is different than the passion for wanting to build a company in general. So I am not someone who just woke up and wanted to be a founder one day.

It was never something that ever came to my mind. It wasn't even an option. Um and then when I went back to I ended up going to Stanford for business school not knowing what I wanted to do, but just knowing that I wanted to see more women in executive positions. And that's what drew me there.

I, you know, how can I grow my network? How can I help future generations of women? Because in the past I really was not surrounded by any. And at Stanford, like everyone else in my class, I said, you know, I'm gonna be a venture capitalist and I'm going to invest in female founders and I'm going to change the game this way.

So fast forward, I actually started a small VC fund with my classmates where we invested in we raised capital from our classmates and then deployed that capital in our classmate startups. When I was doing that as well as doing some internships in VC, I learned that I hate being a VC and I love building. And that's really where I came I came to terms with, oh wait, my classmates are doing this. I have good ideas, I have operating experience.

Why can't I give it a try? And I really saw also by taking this leap, how much I can also influence other women that are maybe earlier in their founder journey to say, hey, I can do that too, because I do that with other women who are much further along than me. I love that. Super interesting.

So what would be and I'm gonna go off script now because I'm super interested. You've been on the VC world where you're kind of deploying a bit of capital. What would you recommend founders do when they're having conversations with with VCs or PE firms or someone that's looking to invest. What's what's like two or three things that they should like must have when they're having those conversations?

Because it's super hard to raise capital right now. I'm definitely not an expert in VC, so you should ask a real VC this question. But I will tell you it from a founder's lens. Yeah.

So I think a mistake that I saw in a lot of my classmates was that the goal for founders were to raise was to raise VC funding. Whereas I thought about the goal is to build a multi-billion dollar company and VC funding is just a means to get there. And so I saw a lot of folks kind of building companies around VC feedback of pitching ideas, taking the feedback, iterating, going back to that same VC. And when they see that, that is not a positive signal to them.

They want someone who has high conviction in the idea, has done the research, done, knows the market better than anyone, put in the hours, put in the hustle. So my advice is always focus on your idea, focus on the market, become smarter than anyone on this very specific idea. Do as much homework as you can, build initial prototypes, become, get in the brain of your customers, and then you can start to build relationship with VCs. So that would be my my first piece of advice is focus on your company until you feel the need that you have to raise.

Once you feel the need that you have to raise, I would say focus on I actually built a lot of relationships for my series A, not my seed, but for my series A, I built a lot of relationships ahead of time with VCs. And so I do that now, like once a quarter, I'll block off a day and you know, take some VC meetings that of folks that I continue to build the relationship with. So that when it's time to fund raise, it doesn't feel like you're getting to know the person for the first time. It's more a conversation, here's an update on where the business is today.

Would you like to chat further? Wow, like any other sales process. crazy. Right, right.

Imagine that. You can't you can't just say, hi, nice to meet you, please give me money. Um, go go figure. I I I love that and I love a lot of what you said, you know, both the different approaches that you tried doing something and realized, hey, this isn't what I want to do and like let let's go build something.

I I I'm super curious, Alexa. You came in to build a space that is super crowded, right? Like it's not a um easy space. It's not a like, wow, we're we're the only ones who do this.

You might be the ones who do it best or do it a different way. But the whole like signal-based playbook, predictable revenue. Like what made you say like, I'm gonna not only start a startup and not only be a founder, but I'm gonna do it in the single most competitive spot of sales tech out there. One of our values is delusional optimism.

So I think I'm a little delusional and a little optimistic is my real answer. Um, I, I mean if you I love that. If you rewind three years when we started Pocus, we were starting in the product-led sales category where there must have been 30 other players at that time. And for us, I remember thinking like, shit, there's a lot of companies that have raised a lot more money than us, uh have much bigger teams, founders that have done this before.

And you know what? We think we have a unique insight and different skill sets that we can just take this delusional optimistic mindset and keep pushing forward. And the reality is when you have a competitive market, that means there is a real need and likely a big market. And so right now we're kind of expanding from product-led sales to signal-based selling.

To me, if anything, it's exciting. We already know how to be extremely kind of, I always say be very customer-focused, competitor aware. We know how to kill competition. I don't know if that's PC to say.

Um and we really know our customers. Um and if there's so much many competitors, to me that just tells me that's a huge market and a real need. So if anything it gets me excited. I'm super excited I'm super happy you said that.

Like so many people shy away from competitors, oh no, a competitor. And as we talked to our founders, we're like, no, competition is actually good. It means you're validating the market, people really need what you want. So, super uh super excited that you you got on that path.

Um So you're you've kind of went back to school and then you went to start a company. And now you have a decent size company, raised a series A. How has your leadership style like from let's say from when you were going into Stanford to where you are today? How's that evolved?

It's totally different. I when I was starting Pocus, I was learning how to be a founder, a CEO, a manager, and run every function. So head of sales, marketing, now I'm not head of marketing anymore. CS, whatever that is.

So I didn't know how to do any of this. So it was trial by fire. It was a lot of mistakes. It was a lot of patience for my early hires as I learned what my leadership style is.

Um I got an executive coach early on, which was a game changer for me to quickly find the blind spots and understand where I need to grow and he did kind of feedback sessions with my direct reports and funneled that feedback to me and I had a lot to work on. Um, and I still have a ton to work on and I think, you know, it's only been three years of kind of a leading a company. I'm sure in six years I'll feel different, in nine years I'll feel different. Um but it has changed a lot.

I think, I mean, I don't know, you can talk to my team to figure out the specifics. But I do, I do think some of it is going from driving urgency around everything to figuring out where to focus. This is still a work in progress for me, but early on I wanted to do everything and now I'm trying to remain focused. It doesn't always work, but that is where I'm trying to lean more into.

I love that. What's it's what's loud versus what's important, right? Like as the CEO, everyone want like I I need you to do this and I need you to do that and this is important. But what's really gonna drive the business forward?

What's going to drive the product or the revenue forward? Um, one of the things that I I found fascinating from just looking at Pocus early on. Um, and having worked with and for folks that thought they were competitors that I don't think are competitors. Is there's this whole like product led growth, right?

And what is product led growth? And I think there's a lot of misnomers out there of like, oh, we're gonna go be a PLG company, or we're gonna go use signal-based playbooks. Can you tell me from your point of view and Pocus's point of view, like, what the hell is what should product led growth be and look like versus this mindset of, oh, we're just gonna go put some trial on our website and we're gonna let the product grow our company. It's a great question.

PLG has become such a buzzword. And so maybe trying to speak without using buzzwords, which is gonna be hard. PLG is a spectrum and we say this with product led sales too. You can have super self-serve product led growth startups or companies like Slack or Calendly or Zapier.

End users can get a ton of value from the product without talking to a human. And then on the other side, you have very sales led companies like Oracle and Salesforce. You couldn't get any value until talking to a human. To me, I wouldn't obsess over are we PLG or not, are we product led sales or not?

It's what is the best motion or channels or playbooks for our business. And you're gonna be somewhere likely on that spectrum between the Slacks and the Oracles of the world. And how you figure this out is a lot of experimentation, but it's also a lot based on who are your buyers. So for dev tool companies, you almost have to be PLG or have some sort of self-serve element because developers don't wanna talk to anyone.

Whereas if you're selling HR tech, I think of the lattises of the world. HR professionals want to talk to humans. So self-serve doesn't always work. And so you can also think about deal size.

Are you selling, you know, $50 per user per month, or are you selling hundreds of K of enterprise licenses? So to me, if you take out everything on buzzwords, it's really, you're gonna be somewhere on that spectrum and it's figuring out based on your sale cycle, your deal size, your buyers, how senior you're selling to. Are you selling to a junior IC, or are you selling to the CTO? That is what should dictate your playbooks.

Um, with signal-based selling, if we also, that's a new newer buzzword out there, but one that we have really started leaning into because it does really excite me. If you simplify it at its core, it's how can you use signals or data in order to inform your go-to market motion. So how can we look at all of this data, whether it's first-party or third-party, whether it's users on your product, on your pricing page, somewhere on LinkedIn or Twitter interacting with you, how can you use that to be very data-driven and timely and personalized with your outreach? So, buzzwords aside, it's coming back to being kind of thinking critically and first principles about your business and then doing the playbooks and motions that work best for you.

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Wow, we're getting we're getting back to the basics. I love it. Um, I see you as someone that challenges assumptions a lot. Um, going from where you were at Stanford, through like starting, I'm gonna be a VC, and then, no, I wanna run a company.

And so, um, as you've gone through that journey, I'm sure you've gotten tons of advice from people that said, do it this way, or do it that way. Give the audience a couple of things that you were like, I know that you think this is the right way, but I'm gonna go a completely different way. I do this a lot. Um, I learned, I remember at Stanford Business School, what they told us a lot is feedback is a gift.

And I take feedback or advice. It is a gift. I appreciate all feedback I get. Um, I lead with feedback to my team.

I think about that with advice as well if I'm seeking advice from someone in a specific domain or a founder that's ahead of me. But I always remember, gifts can be returned or kept. And you can remember that the advice that you receive or the feedback you get, if it doesn't sit well with you or if your gut if you don't believe in it completely, it can be returned. So when I think about that, I had to get better over time with trusting my gut and going against the common kind of advice I would get from folks.

So, great example of that, early on, we were serving product-led growth companies and we built a whole brand and community around product-led sales. We ourselves were not product-led growth. We did not have a self-serve model, whereas all of our competitors did. So on LinkedIn and on Twitter, we would get hate of, this is ridiculous, you're selling to PLG and you're not PLG yourselves.

But we went back and said, should we be PLG? Should we have a self-serve model? And where we answered was no. We are selling all the way to the CRO.

We want to be selling 100K plus deals. We have to do security reviews connecting to the data warehouse. So we were one of the only competitors in our space who did not become PLG. And that was advice that I heard from everyone that I went against, but it ended up saving the company because we then entered a down market where all of the PLG SMB customers churned.

And so I think sometimes you just need to think first principles before listening to the advice from other. Love that. Yeah, it's it's so easy to get caught in the the echo chamber, right? Of like everyone's saying this or everyone's doing that.

And I think stay staying true to those principles, um, is certainly important. One of the things that I think fascinates me especially with y'all being, you know, about three years old, is kind of that balance of growth versus sustainability, right? And I think you based on your timeline, it's almost like you started at the downturn of like, spend all this money as quick as you can and hire as many people as you can to hold that money and stay in, you know, scale responsibly but still fast. When you look at that balance, how have you and you know, Pocus managed that growth versus sustainability and like talk the audience through some of those difficult choices you've had to make, um, that looks at like, is it grow or is it hold on to the cash in the bank?

We were fortunate that at the time that we were ready to grow, it was past the hype of over hiring. I'll be transparent there. I don't know what I would have done if we had to grow in 2021 or 2020. So we have always kept an extremely lean and efficient team.

And we have kind of a perspective of don't hire until you desperately feel the pain, which feels very painful, but then it it really matters in the end because you know that everyone you bring on is going to add huge impact to the team. Yeah. And so, I mean, people are shocked that we're only 25 people and we only plan to go to 35 by end of year. And so we really to me, it's sometimes more people, more problems and stay as lean and small and efficient for as long as we can.

Yeah. More Dale, more more Dale, more problem. I I totally agree. And I you know, it's funny when I used to run sales teams, people would always say, oh, you gotta grow faster.

I'd have investors talking about growing faster. I said, like until we get to a point where the reps cannot, like they can't take any more meetings, they can't take any more deals, and things are starting to flow over to me as the the head of the the sales group, then we can start talking about bringing on more people. Because then the deals that I'm working on, I can actually give to the new sales hires because who wants to come into a new sales opportunity or or job without any leads coming in? So, I love that perspective.

Um, very good. So, one of the things that um, we look at is the the go-to-market dynamics. So, you have kind of gone all the way through your go-to-market dynamics, um, from marketing, you have sales, you're doing a bunch of things. Um, how do you, how do you balance, because you said you're very lean in what you do.

How do you balance not growing so fast, so you're bringing on a bunch of customers? How do you balance that I need to spend more money versus like, let's grow sustainably versus, I only have a window of opportunity and I feel like I need to jump through that window of opportunity now. Like how do you balance that in your head? Yeah, I will say, this looks very different than a later stage company.

So I'm talking as just a seed or series A company. If we were series B or C or D, I think we would feel the pressure to more aggressively hire and grow. Um but at the series A stage, one of the hacks is having a lot of generalist where all hats type of people. So everyone can step in.

So my head of product does a lot of customer success. My head of marketing will step in and do some sales. Um and so it is and my co-founder and I, which I think are different, can both sell and do customer success, which I think usually there's one technical, one non-technical co-founder. He is technical and he's the CTO, but he's extremely strategic and consultative and great with customers.

So I think what has been good for us to date has been the ability for all of us to flex in different roles as needed. But that looks different when you scale. Like now we're starting to get to the point of, all right, how do we get my co-founder and I out of some of these conversations? And how do we make this repeatable?

So we're in a different stage than, you know, us in six months when it's, you know, we have a repeatable motion. Now we need to multiply that by two or by four. Um, now we're kind of in the phase of all hands on deck, just get things done. Yeah, I think and that is an a a great early hack, right?

Like there's we we do something similar. Like there's a lot of things that, you know, Dale's great at, that I'm great at, that Jake's great at, um, but we can overlap. Um, a lot of our clients, for example, you know, need RevOps help. And rather than going out and hiring someone RevOps, like little fun fact, I happen to be an admin in Salesforce and HubSpot.

It's not my day-to-day that I want to do, but like if a client needs it, like I'd much rather be able to provide that resource than telling them to go spend money and go go hire someone else. Like it's it's a great value add. I love the fact that you talk about Sandy Sandy's your head of marketing, right? Yeah, she closed our first deal.

Like hearing that your I love it. And I love hearing about marketer selling. We're big believers that everyone should be tied to revenue one way or another. Um, and we all sell, we just don't realize it.

And if your marketer who is building your messaging and your verbage and like your your product, can't sell the product. There's probably bigger conversations that need to be had. So, kudos to Sandy for closing some deals. Um, I'll even tell you a funny story.

Whenever we launch a new product, we actually send her in. So we just launched job switchers, which is um, a feature in Pocus that's competitive with User Gems or Chiffi. We just send her out and said, Sandy, can you figure out how to sell this thing? And that was more efficient than me doing it.

And um, another hack is hiring a really good BizOps team. So we have a three-person BizOps team that basically does anything that's not sales, marketing, customer success or engineering. And I literally mean anything. And they can just like jump into anything and figure it out.

So that BizOps is really helpful. Yeah, people grossly underestimate the power of BizOps, RevOps. Sorry, Dale. I looked like you wanted to say something.

No, it's it's really hard to hire those people. I think that's the challenge that a lot of people have is these people that I disagree. Really? I just ran the stats this morning because we're hiring someone else.

We had in a matter of days 1500 applicants, of which right now we're down to 30 extremely qualified applicants that we can't decide between. I think it is the easiest role to hire from for. Not not BizOps not BizOps in general. I'm talking about people that can go across multiple functions in a business.

So yeah, BizOps I think there's a lot of really good BizOps people and people that have either been technical but want to get more in business or business people that want to like really focus on some of the technical pieces. I I do think that's becoming a a thing. I just think it's very difficult to find all A players in the stage that you're at because they have to have as much passion as you do. That origin story, that thing that you're building out.

Um, but also, you know, once they do I think once they do it a couple times, like they don't wanna go back to do it. So then you gotta find people that can do it again. So, that is very fair. Go ahead, Adam.

Another balance question. Um, and and this one I think fascinates me more especially when you're you're talking about like a lean team, um, and working cross-functionally. It's that balance versus innovation and execution. And what I think we've certainly seen with a lot of founders is they struggle on like, how do you ship product really effing fast versus how do you make sure you're shipping good product?

How do you guys balance the need for like, we gotta get this out, but we also need to make sure that like it it's great and our customers love it. Mm-hm, great question. One of our values is I'm talking a lot about my values, but our values, our one of our values is ship orate, which means ship and iterate. And we say this every single day.

We are much in the mindset of get something out there and learn and experiment versus having it perfect. So when we build V1 of any product, it is a pretty janky version. It could even be Figma mockups. It could be I remember back in the day actually, when Isaac and I, my co-founder and I were figuring out the idea of what we wanted to do for Pocus, we actually pretended to be AEs at one of our one of the uh, competitors companies and tried to go sell their product.

This was in a different space. And when we were trying to sell their product, we're like, this is enough information for us, we don't want to do this. It doesn't seem like a good market. And so finding ways to test it could be, you know, making website fake websites and wait lists and Figma mockups, just doing the very MVP of understanding how can you validate this without putting a lot of engineering hours towards it.

Once you feel the pull, that's when you have to start dedicating engineering time. And we have conversations every quarter when we're doing road mapping of what percent should go to existing customers and what percent should go to new business. And it does shift based on the market and the quarter. I love that.

I love it. Interesting. Super cool. So, uh, it's now that time of the show.

We believe uh, in giving more than receiving. And uh, you've been generous to give back to the audience. I'm dying to find out because we've talked about three or four different things. What are you gonna give back to the audience?

I am going to give back. I'd love to I will nominate Sandy, our amazing head of marketing to do a consulting session on either product-led sales or signal-based selling. She's truly the queen of both of those things. And anyone would be lucky to steal some of her time.

So, we will give back 30 minutes of Sandy's time. I love that. Don't feel bad. Dale Dale nominates me for stuff all the time and I get to some of my Oh yeah, I I told someone that you were going to spend some time with them.

Like, thanks, Dale. Appreciate that. Um, I I think that's super super valuable give. Um given all of the misnomers about both of those categories to really hear it from someone who lives it every day and is defining that market.

Um, is not something to And can sell. And can sell. We'll we'll we'll have to think of something cool for that giveaway. Um, all right.

As we wrap down, um or wind up, I'd love to do some rapid fire. The the role the rules here are simple. Um five words or less, otherwise, um, Dale gets in trouble and I don't know something happens to Dale. Um, all right.

Let's rock and roll. Alexa, you can't be in tech, and I'm gonna put another caveat on this. You can't be in VC either. What profession are you gonna do tomorrow morning?

You gotta start over. Hmm. That's a tough one. I always joke.

I would love to go back and just be a barista and like chat with customers all day and like really get into a good craft of coffee. I always try to Oh, this is not rapid fire, but I always try to make good coffee and it's really bad. So that would be not I don't know if I would do that, but one idea I joke about. That's funny.

My daughter was a barista this summer for Starbucks and she loved it. There you go. I need to talk to your daughter. Yeah, exactly.

She she loved talking to all the people. Um, first app you check when you wake up in the morning. I try not to. But it is Slack.

Slack. I knew it was gonna be Slack. Alexa, are you an early bird or a night owl? Early bird.

I woke up at 5:30 this morning and probably panicked my team with a million Slacks. They go hand in hand. I'm interested in this one. I think I know the answer to this one.

What's the most used emoji in your work chats? The Pocus magic ball. Yeah. Mm.

I thought that was gonna be the answer. What um what's the one thing you do to unwind after a long day? I don't unwind. No, I I I really do have to work out uh if it's at night or in the morning to unwind.

Awesome. Last one is we wrap this thing up. Dream vacation destination. A beach anywhere.

A beach anywhere. I love it. We're where are you you in New York, Alexa? I am.

Yeah, I was gonna say the buildings and the sirens in the background. Yeah, this does not look like a beach. When when when you guys want to hold an offsite in Florida, we have both coasts covered for you. Dale is in Tampa.

I'm over in the West Palm area. Plenty of beach. Um I will also be sending you some really good coffee following this call because I share a love of coffee with you. Um so we will do that.

Alexa, thank you so much for joining us for chatting about Pocus. Where can people find you and where can people find Pocus? Yes, you can find me on LinkedIn, Alexa Grable, Pocus, Pocus.com.

You can also join our community. It's Pocus.com/community and you can DM me in the Slack once you're uh let in. She checks it every morning.

I'm always in Slack. Every morning. Yeah, yeah, I'm I'm with you. Alexa, thank you so much for joining.

It was great to have you. Uh have an awesome rest of the day. Thank you. Thank you.